Interpreting the Rules & DM Frustrations, Thoughts and Fumbles
The discussion on Saturday night has got me thinking about the fact that we all interpret words, rules and ideas differently and some of us can relate the role-playing actions to what MIGHT happen in real life, where as others maybe can’t and accept the DnD rules that, incidentally, have been extensively play-tested over many years.
Yes, 4th edition DnD is quite complex and we are all still getting our heads around it but the one thing (in my humble opinion) is that it feels to me a lot clearer than 3rd ed… in terms of how things are described and / or illustrated. I don’t remember much about 2nd ed of the TWO times (actually it might even have only been once!) I was a PC back in 1991 or 2, but I do know we didn’t have character sheets… the DM must have had them. I don’t claim to be an experienced DM, far from it and have learnt (and am still learning) ‘on the fly’ so to speak. I have relied upon what the boys at school brought with them from the Kirkwall club when they started the group at school 4 or 5 years ago and my reading and re-reading of 3rd and now 4th edition manuals (which I don’t remember word-for-word), D&D Insider, Dungeon Mastering website, and other similar sites including watching games being DMed on YouTube.
In terms of the rules… my confidence as a DM is not great at the best of times and I need the rules as my support and I feel pretty useless at times and can spend hours or days mulling over a situation (but that’s me!). I am prepared to be flexible (like giving Bevan combat advantage when she was firing arrows directly down on top of the werewolf from only a couple of feet or so above) but to enable some sort of consistency, I will try to use the rules as written. Yes, I may let the odd thing go (usually to keep gameplay going) but at the end of the day the structure is there and I plan to use it. When there is some really creative thinking about what you as PCs are doing, then that’s when a DM will have to think ‘outside of the box’. Perhaps there should be a table rule that questioning rules during gameplay (at least not with the view of changing them, so “Why does that happen?” is fine but “I should really get combat advantage for that attack because…” is not). This is certainly crucial for when someone who has never DMed before has a go at this scary, interesting, fun, stressful, nerveracking, etc, etc, role as there is so much to think about. Such discussion of the correctness or otherwise of what is in the manuals can be done during breaks (when I will go and hide in the loo :->>).
“Players get the best enjoyment when they preserve the willing suspension of disbelief. A roleplaying game’s premise is that it is an experience of fictional people
in a fictional world.” James Wyatt, Dungeon Master’s guide: Role Playing Games Core Rules, Wizards of the Coast Inc., 2008, p15
Further thoughts written a week after the above
Talking of table rules, of which there is a good section on page 14-15 of the DM Guide, I think we need to clarify how the game runs. Below is basically what I produced today (edited in the light of some new thoughts and discussions with others) for a young lad at school who is running his first game this weekend based on the DM Guide info. I have included the comments, in italics, that I made as it illustrates some my frustrations that I sometimes feel as a DM running an adventure that I have put many many hours into creating (too many hours if truth be told!). This is originally aimed at the aforementioned 13 year old.
1. Rules discussions should take place out of game play, eg. after an encounter, or preferably during a break from the table or on the blog or at some such other time. The main thing is to try and avoid any discussion over whether the rules as written are correct or not. This takes (a lot) of time out of gameplay and for a DM who doesn’t like conflict (in real life) is is uncomfortable.
2. Players should try to avoid talk over another player’s turn in an encounter unless it is to do with the game or possibly if your are planning your next move. The other thing I find really frustrating as a DM is when you are trying to run an encounter, and dealing with a PC on their turn, and all the other PCs are having a general chitchat. Try to discourage this. If you are sat playing this game then everybody should be focussed on the game, not on last night’s movie or the latest computer game. This applies also to when you are role-playing the characters, rather than in an encounter.
3. Ask your PCs to plan their next turn in a round as other PCs are taking their turn in initiative order. This helps to keep game play moving and avoids PCs being unprepared when it is their turn (and thus wasting time).
4. Decide how often you are going to have a break, for how and when: eg. 5 mins after before or after an encounter. When do you have a longer break? A longer break away from the table, say up to 20 mins, to have a cuppa or eat food could be an idea. It allows for out of game chatter or, if players wish for them to plan their next moves.
5. All dice rolls to be on the table within view of the DM (We all know this anyway! And after all, if you can’t hit a table with a dice then what chance does your character have to hit the enemy with his/her sword/bow/dagger/mace/axe/crossbow/flail… 
)
6. Decide end time for the session and stick to it. I find that even though I may have set a time to end, we often go over it. As DM I have 3 phases of play… 1. Getting going, 2. Middle of the game: a slump, when I feel tired (usually after food), 3. My Second wind when I wake up again: total immersion and involvement when I forget the passage of real time and could probably play forever (or not! :->). If possible I would like you guys to take some responsibility for ending the game. If I have lost track of time, give me a nudge. I think that I might set an alarm during the next session. We would need to decide, though, on what happens if we are in the middle of an encounter when it is time to stop! (Stop and finish, take a photo of model positions for the next session; OR continue to end of encounter? – your choice) Setting the alarm to go off half an hour earlier will allow us to either finish up an encounter or to set up camp (or other suitable ending point).
Different DMs will run their games differently and use the rules as they feel appropriate. If other folk want to have a go at DMing, then it is their perogative to adapt, alter rules to create their own ‘house rules’ as opposed to ‘table rules’. This particular DM hasn’t been put off yet as she likes devising surprises for you guys and can’t wait until you get to your ‘base of operations’ as ANYTHING could happen. Anyway, that has got some frustrations off my chest.
Please feel free to comment in this blog on the issues raised and I will try to deal with them if I feel able to do so and if not I will go and climb a tree and hide…ahh! not possible here! :->
PS. There has been mention of using Fumbles on the roll of a natural 1. What do you think?
“Whenever you make an attack roll of natural 1, your turn immediately ends, and you grant combat advantage to all attackers until the start of your next turn. If the roll is part of a close or area attack, resolve all the other attack rolls before ending your turn.” James Wyatt, Dungeon Master’s guide: Role Playing Games Core Rules, Wizards of the Coast Inc., 2008, p189
It will add an element of uncertainty, random danger into the game and will give an opposite to critical hits.
PPS. To Flank or not to Flank
Some definitions of flanking, which doesn’t really clarify the rule, which if all be told has maybe used the wrong term… I think that is where the ‘confusion’ lies. Maybe it should be called ‘pincer movement’ or ‘double envelopement’ which is basically what the flanking rule does!!! The term, which in reality (dictionary) has several meanings and interpretations, is used in game to describe a particular type of movement which gives combat advantage within the combat structure of the game.
flanked, flank·ing, flanks
[Middle English, from Old English flanc, from Old French flanc, of Germanic origin.]
flanking
1 a: to be situated at the side of ; especially : to be situated on both sides of <a road flanked with linden trees> b: to place something on each side of
2: to protect a flank of
3: to attack or threaten the flank of (as a body of troops)
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/flanking
Iam more than happy to follow the rules in the book and anything the DM feels they need to change.
I would really like to keep the non-game chat down, I feel its very rude to talk over the DM who has put so much time into the story. Also it is hard to follow whats going on and play can get held while someone has to work out what they’ve just missed.
I think all players could do with reading some parts of the DMs hand book to understand what a hard job it is sometimes.
Hi Francis.
Point taken on the talking out of character during gameplay – I admit that was excessive and I was one of the worst offenders. I also agree with you that we should agree to discuss rules interpretations out of character and outside play time. DMing is hard enough as it is – especially if you go to the trouble of making your own adventures.
It’s difficult not to try to apply real life expectations to physical encounters, and galling when the rules insist on applying a bizarre interpretation to a commonly used term whilst excluding it’s more generally accepted meaning (a double envelopment is otherwise known as a ‘pincer movement’ as Mark correctly pointed out). This is all the more so to those of us who have been wargaming and reading military history for over three decades, and in at least two cases have actually put in flanking attacks with real weapons (albeit not real bullets
).
Furthermore, I wouldn’t place too much emphasis on the fact that the rules have been extensively play tested. I have seen plenty of really stupid blunders in games that have allegedly had lots of play testing. This also applies to consumer products, organisations – even the laws we have to live our lives by, so it’s not surprising it occurs in an iteration of an RPG that appears to have been brought out mostly to boost revenue.
On the flanking issue, I think we really want to do away with the term flanking and just give an advantage (or disadvantage) to the attacker (whether PC, NPC or monster) bearing in mind the following:
1) The orientation of the attacker to the target. Basically this can be in front of, to the side of, behind, above or behind. I would suggest a +2 for behind or above, +1 to from the side 0 to in front and -1 to from below.
2) Whether the person/creature being attacked is otherwise engaged, taking into account initiative. This could just be a straight +1 if the target is already being engaged by someone else.
I have no idea if the above would work out or how it would affect the balance of the game – maybe we should try some encounters separate from the adventure.
On a totally unrelated issue, Summer is fast approaching. I know you have outdoor interests too and will understand that it’s a bit frustrating spending a beautiful sunny (and still!) afternoon/evening indoors when I could be out shooting/fishing/bird watching. Like you, I work full time and time off (especially in good weather) is even more precious. For that reason alone, I intend to bow out for a while, though allowing enough time for my characters disappearance to be explicable. I’m not singling out D&D – I’ve also put the archery to bed for the summer and drastically scaled down the amount of time I spend in SL.
See you Saturday
Chris.
Hi, Thank you for your comments Chris. I think your ideas are good, but as a DM there is enough maths for me to remember, let alone having to work out what pluses come when a PC is in a certain position in relation to the monster. If you or someone else wants to set up a playtest of that, you (they) are very welcome. Also, it has to be remembered that as DM I am often controlling lots of creatures at once when players are only having to control the PC and possibly a ‘pet’.
As mentioned in the post: “I will try to use the rules as written. Yes, I may let the odd thing go (usually to keep gameplay going) but at the end of the day the structure is there and I plan to use it.” but if other folk want to DM differenetly, it is up to them.
Further discussion?
In regards to summer… I don’t want to shut down completely (I tend to ‘live’ for my fortnightly DnD but was wondering whether to go for a 3 week interval. Depends on what those going away to uni want to do as well!
Hi. I take your point about having a lot of math to deal with – the flanking rule, however, is a contiual point of irritation. A simpler solution might be to rename it the Pincer Movement or Double Envelopment rule? In the long term I think Mark’s idea of adopting a completely different (and more interesting) combat model bears some merit. I expect he’ll end up DMing at some time in the not too distant future anyway.
I’d rather not even reduce the interval – the problem, as you know, is nice weather being at a premium. The trouble is the unpredictablity of the weather. If we knew, even a day or two in advance that the weather that weekend would be pants, we could schedule a session accordingly. With rigid scheduling, knowing my luck, the one in three week session would end up being on a beautiful day and the other two weekends would be pants. Yet another alternative would be to have evening sessions – at worst you’d end up ‘losing’ an evening’s shooting/horse riding. This would also lend itself to shorter durations. Maybe it’s just that I’m less committed, but I tend to get a bit fidgety and claustro after a few hours tied into anything – even things like D&D that I really enjoy. Ten hours really is pushing the boat out. I know Lindsay suffers with her back and you’ve had similar problems in the past. Obviously those going to uni and working three days a week (or not formally working at all) will have a different perspective. I don’t want to sound selfish, but I ultimately have to operate within my own (very limiting) set of circumstances. I’m not trying to inhibit anyone else.
I’m normally very positive – sorry if I seem to be whinging a lot of late!
Chris
BTW, I think the fumble table is a terrific idea (I think Robert takes the credit for bringing that one up). So it’s not all negativity from me. :- )
The 10 hours really shouldn’t happen again… I will be setting an alarm!
Both R and I have used funble tables in 3rd edition.
Hey guys,
Reading all thats been brought up here I have to concur with several points.
About chat during a session, I have to hold my hand up as another capital offender to this. It’s one of the rules i hate breaking for the simple reason that when i run a game I get as frustrated as Fransice does when folk talk and dont listen! This makes me a hipecrit i know but thats why i’ll be trying hard from now on to keep chat down (unless Seigfried is doing the chatting).
As regards to rules and the ‘flanking’ problem, i find myself agreeing with Chris on his well described point but I also agree that the rules are there to be used. On the hole, Im quite happy to follow whatever the DM (be it Robert or Fransice) decides whether it be playing by the book or using a ‘tweeked’ house rule. The only thing i dont like is when I execute a manouver only to find out that we’re not using a certain rule etc. As long a i know before hand im easy as to what the DM decides.
On the subject of summer, I dont think we should increase the gap between sessions. As has been said if we look ahead at the weather then we can plan around our findings. If Chris prays to Bahumut are answered by good weather and shooting is to comence then instead of Bevan dissapearing we could dip into another game? Linsay has been drawing up a game (though i dont know what stage it’s at as of yet) and I’ve also been throwing around some idea for several games on several game systems. I like the idea of starting a (even a short) game of World of Darkness or something of that ilk as it gives people a break from the fantasy genre. Just a thought.
Lastly, the fumble table is great! Adds that bit of craziness to a battle when the big boss of the dungeon fumbles and chops he mate in half.
Hi gastav
The killer for me is losing a Saturday afternoon, evening – losing a weekday evening really is not that big a deal, so we could even ramp up the frequency to (at least) weekly – particularly bearing in mind that those leaving for Uni may want to cram more gaming in. Alternatively, I can just bow-out for the rest of the summer. Weekends really are precious to me. I’ve been asked to sort the rabbits on a friend’s farm out in Holm which is heaving with them, and weekends are the only time it’s really practical for me to get out there.
Rhiannon